Teen Mania’s ESOAL “Oversight” Committee

After the recent ESOAL expose on KLTV, Teen Mania announced that they would assemble “an independent committee of experts that will evaluate every aspect of this retreat.”

As announced last week, this “independent” committee is comprised of the following people:

Kelly Cox, Nurse Practitioner
Kevin Karrenbrock, Physical Therapist
Russ Bailiff, Licensed Clinical Social Worker
Todd Cox, Youth Minister
Jamie Holder, Deputy Superintendent of Lindale Schools
Molly Adkins, Registered Nurse
C. David Rowlett, Medical Doctor
Cune Pena, Fitness Owner

Is this truly an “independent” committee?

Let’s look at each member to see if they are connected to Teen Mania.

1) Kelly Cox

Kelly Cox works at the East Texas Medical Center, a clinic frequented by TM interns. Kelly was interviewed by KLTV in Part 3 of the ESOAL expose. Other than that, I have not found any substantial link to Teen Mania that would compromise his credibility.

2) Kevin Karrenbrock

Kevin is an elder at CCF, the home church of Ron Luce, David Hasz, Heath Stoner and several other Teen Mania staff members and interns. In fact, the CCF website has a picture of everyone in leadership at their church. Kevin is pictured near the top, as is fellow committee member, Russ Bailiff. Near the bottom you will see both Heath Stoner and Randy Olsson listed as youth pastors. On this CCF page, you can see that Dave Hasz facilitates a Sunday school class.

In addition, word on the street is that Kevin Karrenbrock has been personal friends with the Luce family for nearly a decade.

And of course, Kevin is facebook friends with Heath and Alisa Stoner and Randy Olsson.

3) Russ Baliff

As established above, Russ is also an elder at the home church of Ron Luce, David Hasz and Heath Stoner.

He is facebook friends with Teen Mania staffers Heath Stoner and Kevin Cool, as well as fellow committee member, Molly Adkins.

4) Todd Cox

Todd Cox is a student pastor at New Harmony Baptist Church. He served with the Coast Guard for over 7 years.

Todd has been facebook friends with Heath for over 1 year (Oct. 2009). According to Heath’s facebook wall, they have scheduled times to meet together. Just last week, Todd tagged Heath in a photo of a local youth event. Todd is also facebook friends with Randy Olsson.

5) Jamie Holder

The internet has not revealed any link between Jamie Holder and Teen Mania.

6) Molly Adkins

Molly also attends CCF. She has been facebook friends with Heath Stoner since November 2008 (2 years!). She is also FB friends with Alisa Stoner, Kevin Cool, and Beth Hasz (Dave’s wife).

7) Dr. C. David Rowlett

As far as I can tell, Dr. Rowlett has no substantial ties with Teen Mania. He works at University of Texas Health Science Center at Tyler.

His office does handle the certification for Teen Mania drivers, but that is the extent of their relationship. By itself, I do not believe that relationship is substantial enough to affect Dr. Rowlett’s credibility as a committee member.

8) Cune Pena

Cune owns a gym in Tyler called Premier Fitness. Along with his wife, he also started “12 Spot Ministries.”

Just last week, 12 Spot Ministries promoted and attended Signs and Wonders conference held at CCF. The main speaker was former Honor Academy intern/staff member Blaise Foret. A quick look at the ministry’s facebook page shows a large number of TM staff and interns (current and former).

Cune Pena is also facebook friends with Teen Mania staffers Ron Luce, Heath Stoner, and Melissa King.
______________________________________________

CONCLUSION:

Out of 8 people, 5 of them are confirmed to have substantial personal ties to Teen Mania and/or its senior leadership. Is that really an “independent committee?”

You may also notice what is missing in this list – there is no psychologist! I guess Ron, Dave and Heath do not have any friends in that profession.

This entire “evaluation” is nothing more than a sham designed to satisfy prospective interns and their parents who don’t realize that this is nothing more than Teen Mania calling on their friends to bail them out of a tough situation.

There is no repentance here. There is no remorse. This is a PR move – PLAIN AND SIMPLE. I expect them to come up with a few token changes, but they will not allow anything that substantially altars the abuse at ESOAL nor impinges on the sovereign power they hold over their little kingdom in East Texas.

Many thanks to the forum members for help with this research.

404 Comments on "Teen Mania’s ESOAL “Oversight” Committee"

  1. This is intense!!!!

    R.A., thanks for all the work you're doing. For real.

    I can not even believe T.M. sunk that low. Like, I can't. If anyone here can explain to me why T.M. would sink that low… I'd like to know. How do you justify that???

  2. So, tell me if I have this wrong. T.M. is being accused of practicing unethical/potentially illegal practices on interns.
    Right?
    And they were told to form a committee by kltv? Did KLTV tell them it had to be independent?
    So, Dave says he's going to get together an 'independent' committee by November 1st.
    But the committee is just a bunch of his friends???
    So, he brought CCF into it??? and CCF went with it???
    Teen Mania is a ministry that is well known all over the country and the best they could come up with were some friends from CCF?!?!?!
    And – on top of it – CCF WENT WITH IT.
    So, this 'committee' is all from the same town. I'm assuming they've been in the same town for years and have been hanging out with the same PEOPLE for years. And those people are leadership at T.M.???!!!???!?!?!

    Major fail Teen Mania.
    MAJOR FAIL.
    Please, interns, GI's, staff… get out of that place.

  3. Not at all shocked, SICKENED!! Saddened for the 18 year olds that continue to be used and abused for wanting to love their creator, but not shocked.

    I do ask that if current interns come on this post (or any other) with comments that we keep careful to stay loving toward them. They have been through enough "changing" without us throwing our anger with the staff at them. Most just wanted to be God's in a powerful way, much like we did. If we were still on the inside (or something close to it) it is entirely possible we would feel obligated to protect those that were hurting us. It is also common behavior of those who have suffered abuse to defend their abusers.

    I feel sorry for those kids that year after year feel condemnation at the hands of people they think will bring them closer to God.

    Lord you are our rock please find a way to truly protect those teens under your care from those that are clearly not operating fully in your will!

  4. Is the committee in place to determine the legitimacy of the event or to help facilitate it?

  5. it looks bad for TM I get it but come on guys. It not as if they had a lot time to put this committee together. really they had what, like a maybe month if that? Look, in the end they rushed to put this together so they used what and who they had available.

    don't be so quick to judge until you see what they do. who knows they could surprise us all…or not.

  6. @Jeremy:

    Teen Mania set the November 1st deadline themselves. If they needed more time, they should have given themselves more time.

    But not having enough time is not an excuse! Not in the slightest! Getting INDEPENDENT experts is crucial to the investigation, and if they are not independent, the investigation shouldn't even happen!

    But the worst part is that they are CLAIMING that these people are independent, and they are clearly not. If they had said "We have been unable to fully assemble our team of independent experts before November 1st, so we are moving our deadline back to December 1st to ensure that we find experts in the field who are not related to Teen Mania" I would have been THRILLED, because it tells me that they actually care about doing this right. But they don't, so they didn't.

    Instead, they get together a few friends and call it "good enough", and publicly say this is a team of people unconnected with Teen Mania. The lies make me sick.

  7. Anon at 7:33am – KLTV did not tell TM to form a committee. TM came up with the idea totally on their own. Click the very first link in my post to read the details.

  8. Also, as J. pointed out on the forums, have a look at this:

    "In the interest of making sure this committee and their findings are completed and implemented, Teen Mania will not conduct another E.S.O.A.L. retreat until the recommendations of the committee have been satisfied." –Dave Hasz on the response site

    "This committee will evaluate the L.T.E. planning, the schedule of training leading up to ESOAL and during the event." —Committee announcement

    Pants on fire?

  9. Josh Ex-Intern 00-01 | November 1, 2010 at 3:21 pm | Reply

    @Jeremy – The only way that they could TRULY be independent of TM is if those that did the research on the new committee member found people who had the same names as them with TM contacts. I would be the FIRST to apologize as I was one of the ones researching them right off the bat. TM would have to show proof that could refute the fact that they are connected though. I'm done taking them at their word. They have to EARN my trust from this point forward.

  10. If it's the same Baliff family from Lindale, TX, at least one of their children has participated on GE trips, because I was a TL for a Baliff from Lindale a few years ago…

  11. It is the same Bailiff family from Lindale- two older children- family ties to TM

    Kevin is a well respected PT from Lindale- he has the expertise to do this work if he separates it from his friendships.

    Jamie Holder- also a good guy- former principal of Lindale High School- definitely has the knowledge and insight for this work

    Cune – hopefully will separate from the friendships and deal with this professionally- Based on doing business with him and his businesses- I cant imagine him allowing his facilities personal trainers to do anything like they are doing at TM ESOAL.

    TM Former Staffer

  12. Wouldn't it make sense that they would get people that they know to be part of the committee?
    How else would they know if they were qualified?

    I am not saying that I'm agreeing or disagreeing, I'm just curious as to how you would like them to find the committee if it wasn't people that they already know?

  13. Anon– If you're on a jury and it turns out you know anyone involved in the case, it's declared a mistrial (which is why they would ideally let you go before it got there). Legally, your judgment can't be considered objective since you're not an outsider; it's a conflict of interest. Same applies here.

    For the second part, hop on Google and search for "Clinical Psychologists Texas" (or whatever profession and location you like). In a matter of seconds you can find dozens of people and check their credentials. Surely that couldn't be too hard for Teen Mania? Sigh.

  14. Although I think all the "Facebook friend" accusations are a little weak (I, for one, am facebook friends with dozens of people who do not share my values and beliefs and such…) I do agree that this committee is not entirely independent.

    RA- what do you think about the community on here doing something for this? Like giving recommendations for committee members or something? I think this could be a first step towards reformation for TM and a practical way for those who want to see change at TM to make a difference.

  15. Oh and I removed my post above because there were typo's- nothing shady going on, sorry

  16. Lisa Marie – Feel free to send recommendations to TM. I, however, have no plans to ever contact Ron, Dave or Heath again in the future. They have proven, repeatedly, that they will not listen to our concerns. They will only lie to protect their a*****.

  17. @Anon 1:16 Every state in the United States has a center where you could find people that are qualified to judge the safety of this event. You can find educators, Psychologists, doctors, nurses, physical therapists, and physical trainers with religious affiliation by looking for people with specific certifications. This takes up an hour of internet research.
    Lisa Marie I love this idea!!! Can I volunteer some awesome(PhD psychologists)Professors that would love to see this first hand.

  18. RA-

    I can understand why you don't want to contact TM leadership anymore…I am sure you are frustrated with them and everything.

    But then my question is, what are you trying to do with this site? I know you want to create a place where past interns can be honest about the hurts they experienced thru TM and find healing, but what about the present/future?

  19. Lisa – Not 100% sure I understand your question? I have zero control over what TM does in the future. But I can make people aware of their abuses and scandals.

  20. And just one woman and one hispanic? I have a hard time imagining any minority could stand up with an opinion in the continual sea of testosterone and white power of TM – good lord they need a huge dose of diversity on that campus.

  21. Okay yeah, I was kind of going to ask if that's what you're trying to do but i didn't want to sound accusatory: so you are trying to make people aware of what TM does in hopes that less and less people will go there? And maybe one day the ministry will shut down…?

    Honestly, sometimes it seems like nothing *but* that would satisfy you…

  22. Lisa Marie – I'll answer your question when you answer mine – Why do you think its ok for proven liars and abusers to stay in ministry? Why do you think they should go unchallenged?

  23. Heartsafire-

    Thanks for supporting my thought:-) If you want, click on my name and shoot me an email- maybe we can try to put something together. I really do wanna try and follow up with this. And i think it's possible that it could really say something to TM if this was a grassroots thing that the community came up with together.

  24. RA-

    Okay, I honestly would not expect you to pull the whole "answering a question with a question" thing- I'd think you'd hate when people do that.

    But I think maybe you're misunderstanding me. I never said I think they should go unchallenged, or that i think it's okay for them to stay in ministry if in fact they have lied and abused others purposefully and without repentance. I'm trying to figure out what you want to see happen with TM, like what would finally satisfy you, and it seems sometimes like the only thing would be for TM to say "We have come to realize that our ministry and the people in it have abused and hurt others in terrible ways, and we can longer continue to do this. We are closing down Teen Mania and will not do ministry any longer."

    Does that make more sense?

  25. I will be happy when TM quits lying and abusing people – whatever that looks like.

  26. So, I've been thinking about this all day.
    This is a big deal. It's another bold face lie straight out of the mouth of Dave.
    I personally do not care at all about T.M. and I'm not going to spend any time worrying about it. Praise God, the ministry fucked me up bad enough.
    But if R.A. is going to stand up to them, she can go right ahead. Please do Mica. Dave said in the conference call, he's not accountable to anyone but us. Who else is going to keep them in line?
    I personally think T.M. should be shut down, I'm just not doing anything about it other than supporting the blog. So you go R.A.
    Be bold, cause apparently they are just being stupid. It's not that hard to tame an elephant, it just looks scary. 🙂

  27. Okay, that's fair. But I guess I think that if you've decided to never contact them again, it's going to be hard for you to have a proactive role in making that happen. But like I said, I understand why you don't want to. They haven't exactly been friendly to you in recent months. lol

  28. Lisa Marie-

    What more do you want RA to do…she has written emails, she has been on conference calls with Dave, she has identified herself in the local media, and pretty much, there has been a collective "run for cover" response from TM.

    You're more than welcome to organize a secondary effort, but I think expecting different results from repeating the same process is bordering on that old adage of "insanity"….

  29. Anon @ 3:53-

    No, you make a good point. I don't know that I have any better ideas for RA, lol, and I said in earlier comments that I can def understand why she doesn't want to contact them anymore.

    I guess I just think that closing the door on it may not be the absolute best option out there. I think that when we have conflict with someone/organization, we need to continually be open to resolution and never shut the door on the possibility. That's what the Lord does for us, so we should offer that kind of grace and mercy to others. I know it's hard and it's not always that simple when its dealing with sinful people, but the heart should be the same.

  30. Lisa – Believe me, if TM calls me and repents, I'll be the first one on the reconciliation train. The ball is firmly in their court, now.

  31. LM (May I call you that? Too many Lisas here. Silly popular name)
    I don't think trying to get a group to help us set up a truly independent committee that someone other than us or TM chooses is a bad idea. As I have said via private message I am by far willing to help you try to get some group to be willing to set it up. I do question how any such group would be received or treated by TMM. I do believe they have lost God which is very sad. I am willing to help you come up with an idea on how we could create an independent investigation. Just don't get too hurt if TMM is as unwilling to let anyone but their buddies in as they seem to be.

  32. just because someone has a past connection to TM or is friends with someone on fb…doesn't predetermine their opinions…i mean, if you were researching me on fb, i'd look suspicious! past intern, lots of alumni friends…but as you well know, i am totally not in favor of esoal and a lot of practices at the honor academy…

    i'm not terribly hopeful about this process…and they haven't really given us reason to trust them in this process…but…i dunno, for our own peace of mind, wouldn't it make sense to wait to get up in arms until after they've done their investigation? there still IS a chance that it could lead to legitimate change. (i'm not holding my breath, but still…anything can happen. :-D)

  33. I like brownies | November 1, 2010 at 9:32 pm | Reply

    Lisa Marie,

    I appreciate your willingness to contact TM and attempt to work with them on this issue. I FIRMLY believe that RA has gone above and beyond, and is not in the wrong for refusing to contact TM anymore. RA has demonstrated a willingness to forgive TM (and is still willing), and they have refused it.

    That being said, if you feel called to organize an attempt to contact TM with suggestions, I support you. Thankfully RA has started the ball rolling, and if others feel called to take action, then they should. This blog has given us a place to organize ourselves and take a stand.

    You said "we need to continually be open to resolution and never shut the door on the possibility." I believe that RA has been doing this, and is continuing to do this by being willing to forgive. Repentance is necessary on TM's part in order for there to be restored fellowship.

  34. @I Like Brownies

    Not to put word into RA's mouth, but she has said multiple times that she has already forgiven TM. This site is not about bashing TM, or trying to shut it down, or exacerbating grudges against TM, but for healing from TM's abuses and advocating for TM to stop engaging in such abusive activities.

  35. GC – These aren't past connections. All 5 of these people are currently friends with and/or run in the same circles as TM. That is unacceptable for an "independent" investigation.

  36. I like brownies | November 1, 2010 at 10:25 pm | Reply

    @ Maurice Moss,

    I'm confused… did I mis-communicate? Did I say something that would imply that I thought this site was about "bashing TM, or trying to shut it down, or exacerbating grudges against TM?"

    If I did, I'm very sorry. I agree with what you said. I was simply saying that I believe RA has gone beyond what is required of her by God's Word regarding forgiving TM. But, that if anyone else felt the need to keep contacting TM, they should.

    I'm sorry if I did a really poor job of communicating that:)

  37. @ I Like Brownies

    I was just responding to what you said here: "RA has demonstrated a willingness to forgive TM (and is still willing), and they have refused it."

    I was just clarifying that RA has not just demonstrated a willingness to forgive TM, but actually HAS forgiven them. I think you knew that, but I wanted to make sure others reading got the right idea. I know there's a lot of misinformation flying around regarding the purposes of this site. I think you've got it right, though. No worries. 🙂

  38. Mom of ex-intern | November 1, 2010 at 11:45 pm | Reply

    Lisa Marie: Back when they had the first "independent investigation" with the board of directors, my spouse wrote to Heath directly with an excellent suggestion for an independent psychologist and some other suggestions…his response from Heath was basically "thanks, but no thanks…we've got it handled".

  39. For the record, there is an LCSW on the committee. I'm an LCSW myself, and clinical social workers actually are involved in more therapy than clinical psychologists or clinical counselors nationwide. Personally (in my obviously biased opinion) I believe it is MORE appropriate to have an LCSW as part of the committee addressing mental health concerns than to have a psychologist. LCSWs typically are involved in more hands-on clinical mental health work than any other profession with the possible exception of psychiatric nurses (which is a different kind of mental health work). A psychiatrist would have been a nice addition, but as far as mental health issues are concerned an LCSW is almost as good as it gets.

    That being said, as a social worker I would be concerned about any social worker with ties to TM or TM circles, I could easily see it affecting their credibility. There really are not any reviews available online for this guy but he did go through some kind of accredited masters level program with two years of clinical internships as well as two years of experience and a licensure exam, so I have to assume he knows his stuff at least on some level.

  40. And believe me, I am not one who is often willing to give TM ANY sort of credit, I have the utmost disrespect for the organization.

  41. heartsafire-

    Thanks again for the encouragement that this is a good plan…i'm feeling kind of discouraged about it now, to be honest. @Mom of ex-intern, that's such a bummer that Heath did that…ugh. My only hope would be that if we were to point out how non-independent there current group is, they might recognize that they need to let this happen. I don't know tho, maybe not:-/

    I like brownies (and RA)-

    I fully agree with your first post, I really do. I know RA has done a lot to attempt to work this out, and I understand why she feels the ball is in TM's court now. It's just that when she publicly says "I'm not contacting them anymore" it kinda sends a little bit of a different message- especially considering she is continuing with this website. Does that make sense?

    Maurice Moss-

    Would you agree, though that those things *do* happen on this site, even if they're not the sole intended purpose? That's the problem, i think. It turns people off (including me, in the past,) to the real purpose for the site when they come on here and just see all this bitterness, anger and immaturity against TM.

  42. Thanks for chiming in, Andy. I did notice on his facebook page info that he specifically has worked with abuse victims…

    Lisa Marie – what you see as "bitterness, anger and immaturity" if often part of the healing process for some people.

  43. RA-

    I know that. I have been thru enough tough stuff to recognize that sometimes we need to express our pain in less-than-cute ways. We just need to make sure that doing that is a just one step of a process that is truly headed towards healing. As much as I've wanted it to be true, i've learned that we don't get a free pass at sin just because we're hurting.

  44. Lisa Marie – I'm not discerning enough to know when its sin and when its not, so I leave that to the Holy Spirit to convict on an individual basis. I'd rather give people the benefit of the doubt.

  45. RA-

    Right, that's exactly what each of us should do for our own souls. I'm not talking about judging others here…i'm saying that we should be sure we're not creating a community that encourages bitterness without pointing people towards healing. That's all.

    Honestly, I think that this issue is one thing that has probably contributed to the response you've received from TM administrators (I am NOT saying that it justifies their actions tho.) But they just probably have a hard time seeing past the angry words and stuff, and so they may have just written you and this community off because of it.

  46. Lisa Marie – I think you are giving them too much credit. They choose to disregard this because it threatens their power, ego and livelihood.

  47. I said i think this is "this issue is one thing that has probably contributed to the response." The other things are probably the ones that you listed. We're not disagreeing here:-)

  48. I am an alumni of twentyfourseven leadership academy. They are lesser known, and provided a model for the Honor Academy before it was created. We had a similiar event called "Missions Training" We were not informed of the event, and were kidnapped so to speak. To this day I am deeply upset with my close friend who recruited me. She deliberately misinformed me as to the nature of the program. She was paid to recruit me, and instructed not to tell of any of the hardships. For curiousity, I committed to attend a second year. We were instructed how to recruit, and the compensation for recruiting. We were forbidden to say anything about Missions training, or how demanding the program is overall.

    I would like to strongly warn those who feel called to attend, to examine the hype surrounding these institutions.

    The outrage these events have sparked is amazing. The honor academy's response it to make it an optional event. That does not change the fact that it is a horrific, nightmarish event.

    Seriously, these people are not undergoing a massive spiritual breakthrough; more commonly they are having what I had: a mental breakdown.

  49. Andy, I am as if not more biased as you in the opposite direction. I have seen many LCSWs doing private work in clinics only to have their patients end up coming to where I am interning now with an even more severe problem. As such I would really be against any person who thinks 4 years are = to those of us in clinical Psychologists programs and spend 6 years to get a PhD plus a few years for a post doc to make sure we are good and ready to give that advice. I am the one that pointed out that they are not equal because most LCSW programs just focus on the main stays of practice such as depression and anorexia where as you get a Really intense lesson in all of the disorders if you are a PhD psychologist in that clinical practice. I have questions about a Social workers ability to see the connections to famous experiments done on humans to the LTEs I also have issues with their biases. Both of those concerns make me rather angry at this list

  50. @ Lisa Marie,

    Sure, I have definitely seen people engaging in activities and attitudes that are more rooted in anger and bitterness than a desire for healing and forgiveness. At the same time, though, I also recognize that sometimes expressing those ugly attitudes can be helpful in the healing process (though not in all cases!). Teen Mania had me brainwashed to "never speak ill of Teen Mania", which caused me to never tell anyone about my struggles and problems with Teen Mania. But finally being able to express those problems has done a lot for me in the way of healing, and as a result, I am on the way to forgiving Teen Mania. I haven't forgiven them yet, but I'm getting there.

    Even so, I personally try to be fair and reasonable when assessing their actions. Others might feel the need to express their feelings more vehemently. Others may not desire forgiveness and just want to bash Teen Mania. I can't judge who is bashing and who is healing, but I can see why Teen Mania and TM sympathizers wouldn't be interested in hearing what they have to say because of that.

    So the real question is: can we do anything about that? I don't know. We could hyper-moderate, and anyone who says something unfairly angry against Teen Mania gets banned or deleted. But then we would get rid of some of the good as well as the bad. Furthermore, it would discourage those in the healing process from posting, defeating the whole purpose of the site.

    So people sometimes post angrily on the site, just out of anger. And sometime people post angrily on the site, but it's more rooted in the need for healing from the wrongs that Teen Mania has done to them. Readers of the site might be offended or turned off because of this, including Teen Mania. But I don't see a way (or a need) to filter out the immature ones. If Teen Mania ignores our criticism because of this, then that shows that they don't even take their own advice about confrontation.

  51. Curious George | November 2, 2010 at 2:11 pm | Reply

    @ Ariel

    I'm sorry to hear about that Ariel. People are a funny thing. They will throw all logic and love out the window in the name of God. They've been enlightened and know the way. Thats why they lied to you to get you to join, because they knew best.

    Just because its optional doesn't change the fact that its horrible and nightmarish. You're spot on.

    Many of the most dangerous activities are billed as massive spiritual break through opportunities (E.S.Opportunity of A Lifetime, Life Transforming Event). As such, it becomes much easier to discredit logic and instinct which would naturally tell you not to participate in dangerous activities. This may point to a larger issue. That individual use of logic and following one's instincts must often play second fiddle to whatever is deemed by leadership to be "spiritual."

  52. heartsfire–

    Not really wanting to get into this kind of debate because it's not the focus of what we're talking about, but I've worked on multi-disciplinary teams for my entire career and I could not disagree with you more as to the qualifications and credentials of social workers.

  53. And that comes from someone who is also working on his Phd in social work

  54. RA, you did kind of contradict yourself in your comments here.
    At 11:31 "I'm not discerning enough to know when its sin and when its not, so I leave that to the Holy Spirit to convict on an individual basis. I'd rather give people the benefit of the doubt."

    At 11:44 "I think you are giving them too much credit. They choose to disregard this because it threatens their power, ego and livelihood."

  55. Philip – Not really. Its all about context. I give victims the benefit of the doubt – not repeat offenders.

  56. gracemakesfree | November 5, 2010 at 2:20 pm | Reply

    If they were truly serious about this committee being independent, they would have brought in people who have never even heard of Teen Mania.

    I can't believe how blatantly unethical TM is being.

  57. Okay, I have been visiting this site off and on for the past 3 months ever since my almost 21 year old daughter announced her intention to "go to school at the Honor Academy". I am a Licensed Counseling Psychologist and a career guidance counselor and I would love, love, love, love to be on this committee. I would take unpaid leave from my job to be on this committee. I can tell you that this is one of the most horrible examples of emotional abuse and blackmail in the name of Christianity that I have personally encountered in my almost 60+ years of life! How can we get somebody to seriously investigate this organization and take it down? Can we do it by directing attention at it's financials?

  58. Anon – Thank you for sharing. I think any and all attention we can direct at TM's shady practices is a good thing, including financial improprieties.

  59. Anonymous 2:39–I would email Heath Stoner at heath.stoner@teenmania.org and tell him you want to be on the committee and I'm sure he will do his best to put you on it.

  60. Yes, I'm sure he'll get right on that! lol

  61. Anon 2:39- Even if (dare I say "since") they won't let you on the committee, you should continue to investigate and make your findings public. Make yourself available for comment to the press and professional organizations as well. Your opinion carries a lot of authority because of your credentials. The last thing they want is remarks on the public record from qualified professionals saying they're abusers!

  62. Licensed Counseling Psychologist at 2:39pm: As the comment said above, please email me at heath.stoner@teenmania.org so we can discuss putting you on the committee.

  63. Nunquam Honorablus | November 8, 2010 at 10:49 pm | Reply

    Hi Heath! I'm glad it's not a sin to read this blog anymore! 😉

  64. I smell a rat…

  65. Geez, a committee where the majority are already affiliated with these people with no, I mean NOBODY qualified to deal with psychological/ trauma issues in any substantive fashion.

    IMO this is the exact opposite of an independent, qualified committee.

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